I have to agree though, in fact when i see one I always think "there goes a posing little ****" and its not like its a jealousy thing - when everyone was getting ipods i got a creative and now I have a sony mp4 player - they are just miles better than the bland peice of crap ipod. And its not like its one of those nerdy anti-mac attitudes that I have, cos I'd love a mac-book or any mac pc for that matter... just everything else I would confidently say was not value for money.